bermuda mowing problem

Tde – posted 16 June 2003 06:39

I’m new to bermuda grass. I’ve now read that it should be kept at ~0.5-1 inch or so. My bermuda lawn currently is about 2-2.5 inches. The problem is that the brown stalks on the grass are themselves .75-1.5 inches so I am reluctant to cut that low. Am I forever stuck with a long lawn now? Is there any way to get it back to 1 inch? Any help is appreciated, thanks.

Brad – posted 17 June 2003 13:57

For a manicured appearance, Bermuda can and should be cut at the level you mentioned (min. 0.5″ to max. 1.0″). You are not necessarily stuck with a “long lawn”, but you will have to work to “train” the grass to be mowed at that lower level since it is accustomed to the higher height. If you want to get the lawn lower this season, my thought would be to mow it one notch lower every week until you get to the desired level which should take about 4 to 5 weeks or so. However, you may not want to do that because of the brown or scalped appearance you will have during the training process. An alternative would be to wait until next spring and then as the grass begins to come out of dormancy, scalp it down as low as your mower will go to remove the dead blades left from winter kill. Then, as it continues to green up, just keep it mowed at the desired height once it reaches that level. Bermuda spreads by stolons (or runners) that grow horizontally across the ground. Lower mowing promotes this horizontal growth and results in better coverage assuming all other factors (min. 6 hours of direct sun, irrigation, fertilizing, etc.) are OK. Good luck and if possible, use a reel mower to achieve a golf course-like cut that is short and carpet smooth. You’ll love the result.

Lawn Weasel – posted 05 September 2003 12:15

I, too have the same “bermuda grass is too tall” problem… Bought a new house w/ sodded bermuda, didn’t have a mower the first few weeks, grass got tall. Now it’s mowed regularly but is about 3″ tall. I love the carpet-like feel of bermuda, and don’t want to hurt it by scalping… I already take off all the green each time I mow (weekly, sometimes every 5-6 days when I can), so it’s brown for 3-4 days until the green tips appear, but it’s back to square one by then. Can I scalp it even more than I’m doing? There are parts of the yard (I think they get more sun) that don’t “green up” even after a week, and the front doesn’t grow much overall anyway. I have a loam (sandy?) soil, and have not used any fertilizers yet.

Dchall_San_Antonio – posted 10 September 2003 22:59

When bermuda is continually mowed low it turns into a prostrate grass with a lot more density than when it is allowed to get tall.

Bermuda needs to be on a regular cycle of fertilizer.

HART209 – posted 07 October 2003 19:26

I also had the overgrown bermuda lawn. In spring I did as recommended and scalped it as low as possible. Could not have been happier with results. But as summer came on I found myself just not being able to keep up with the sometimes twice a week mowing. Now I’m afraid to mow low for fear of winter kill.

Ron Duca – posted 13 October 2003 11:10

I have a couple of questions regarding grass height for a bermuda lawn. 1) How much higher, if any, should I make my final cut before winter? 2) When measuring grass height, do you just stick a ruler down through the grass or do you go by the height of the mower blade(s) on a hard, flat surface?

Mo Lawn – posted 19 October 2003 00:32

quote:Originally posted by Ron Duca:I have a couple of questions regarding grass height for a bermuda lawn. 1) How much higher, if any, should I make my final cut before winter? 2) When measuring grass height, do you just stick a ruler down through the grass or do you go by the height of the mower blade(s) on a hard, flat surface?

From my experience with my own bermuda lawn… your “final mowing” height depends upon the overall health of the lawn. If it is realatively healthy, well fertilized and watered, I would not change the mowing height. If the lawn health is “so-so”, then raising the mower 1 click (or about 1/2″) would be a good idea. You can return to normal mowing height next year with your 1st cutting. When burmuda goes dormant in the fall, the leaves transports and stores energy in the rhyzomes… then in the spring, the plant uses that energy for new growth. So, the more energy that goes to the rhyzomes in the fall, the better… by means of more leaves, and/or nutrient storing efficiency (health).When setting mower height, go by a flat level surface and follow your mower’s owner’s manual. If your yard is like mine, you will get frustrated trying to run around the yard with a ruler trying to measure the height of the grass. My yard is so uneaven… on the bumps the grass is 1″ and in the dips it is 3″ with the same mower setting.

Reel Guy – posted 24 August 2004 12:08

Concerning Brown Spot in the Bermuda Lawn…I am not a train professional but have been growing hybrid bermuda lawns for 15 years. From this I have read, asked questions and mostly experimented with the process of Hybrid Bermuda maintanance.The first thing to ask is … What is Hybrid Bermuda? Hybrid Bermuda is a specially developed variety developed for special applications. Tifway 419 has become the builders choice for new homes becuase it is readily available in the south of the US. Chances are that if you are experiencing brown areas when mowing, you probably have a hybrid 419 bermuda. Common bermuda doe snot exibit this issue as much as hybrids and I will explain the difference. hybrids are typically a more dense growing grass. This means that sun light will have a hard time getting to the bottom of the plant when the grass is really dense in growth. In early spring as the grass begins to green up, most allof the growth will be green and leafy. This is becuase it is short and not as dense allowing a maximum coverage of sunlight to the plant. As the season moves forward, the grass will want to grow taller if your mower setting (and frequency of mowing) allows it to do so. As the grass grows taller, the leafy area will only be at the top area where the maximun sun exposure is allowed. The lower area becomes just like a tree trunk pushing the top of the plant up higher to compete with the surounding grass for sunlight. This trunk is the brown part of the grass you see when you mow. Hybrid grass leaves are bread to grow short, however, the stem is not. This is why only the top small portion of the grass is green.What to do?????Mow low and often. Look at you grass now. how much leaf do you have that is green. That should be your maximum cutting height. For hybrids, this is probably around 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch. To cut it this low you will need a Reel Mower. Reel mowers like McLane are available and are reasonable in price as compared to the higher quality greens mowers available. For home use, McLane is a good choice. OK, you have a new rotorary mower you just purchased. What do you do? Mow low and mow often. Your rotorary mower will probably not mow any lower that a 1 inch seting and if it does, the problem is that the case surrounding the blade will be dragging the ground and making it difficult to go forward through the thick low cut grass. So then what. Mower a notch higher and mow often.What if I do not mow often?Then deal with brown patches!!!Another cause for brown areas. If fertilizing with too high of a nitrogen fertilizer, then you will expereince excess leaf/stem growth leading to stemming. Stemming is what I call it when you are mowing all of the green off and leaving nothing but brown stems.SO, in summary…Mow often, fertilize moderate, and mow low for a fuller green look.

cas6708 – posted 24 August 2004 22:45

I have been reading up on reel mowers because I am thinking about getting one. But I have now read in a couple of different places that a push reel mower is not recommended for the Tiff 419 grass that I have.

Any suggestions, thoughts, or critism?

Alex_in_FL – posted 27 August 2004 16:53

Bermuda… try Roundup. A good dose usually kills about 98% of the darn weed!!!

Ah just kidding, bermuda is an AOK grass.

I have been trying to figure out if there is any way to find my Grandfather’s old reel mower. It was a gas engine (had to mix oil and gas) but it would be great for zoysia or bermuda.

Pushed a reel mower lately? Last time I did was over 2 decades ago. With luck the next time I push one will be many, many decades in the future to celebrate turning 100!!

Buck – posted 29 August 2004 09:04

I doubt that you can mow healthly 419 with a push mower. The turf is so dense that the wheels cannot apply enough force to the reel to cut the grass. The wheels slide rather than turn and the reel is locked up with a blade at the cutter bar. Been there. Significant force is required to keep the reel spinning on 419.

The Entertainer – posted 22 September 2004 18:23

so is it possible to get a good cut with a push mower set at the lowest setting

Buck – posted 23 September 2004 11:16

No

love to mow – posted 14 October 2004 11:52

Will someone please pass along informatin regardign which fertilizer to use and a schedule? I wish to mow year round if possible. I live in Midlothian TX… Just south of Dallas TX.

As well, what numbers should I be looking for in the name – 13,13,13?

cohiba – posted 14 October 2004 18:14

Fertilizer scheduling is tricky. It really depends on soil types, any deficencies your soil has and the needs of the turf. If your fertilizing to keep mowing; that is ok during the season. As long as you are aware that fertilizing at the wrong time will increase disease pressure. If you fertilize to keep the turf from going dormant; your setting yourself up for winter kill. The turf you are managing is different all over the country. There is no magic scheduling bullet. Start with a soil test and see what your turf needs. Then get recommendations from the local state cooperative extension for the turf type you are managing. Once that is all established if you decide to push the envelope you can try. The turf will respond but it will have a good foundation to build on. As always, if you get a soil test and want help with the analysis you can fax it to me and I will give you some pointers and some ideas. I do about 68-75 soil tests per year. From sand to clay.

Hope that is understandable…………..

Good luck………

love to mow – posted 25 October 2004 15:33

Currently it is 25 October, when should I stop fertilizing. In Dallas, TX the temps are high….80-85 degrees and the grass is growing well. I last fertilized a week ago to help get the roots growing (used 13,13,13). I think I should stop and allow the turf to go dorment and keep cutting till it stops growing. I think I will get at least 3-4 weeks worth of cutting before it gets tryly cold.

Your thought would be greatly appreciated.v/rLove to Mow

quote:Originally posted by cohiba:Fertilizer scheduling is tricky. It really depends on soil types, any deficencies your soil has and the needs of the turf. If your fertilizing to keep mowing; that is ok during the season. As long as you are aware that fertilizing at the wrong time will increase disease pressure. If you fertilize to keep the turf from going dormant; your setting yourself up for winter kill. The turf you are managing is different all over the country. There is no magic scheduling bullet. Start with a soil test and see what your turf needs. Then get recommendations from the local state cooperative extension for the turf type you are managing. Once that is all established if you decide to push the envelope you can try. The turf will respond but it will have a good foundation to build on. As always, if you get a soil test and want help with the analysis you can fax it to me and I will give you some pointers and some ideas. I do about 68-75 soil tests per year. From sand to clay.

Hope that is understandable…………..

Good luck………

cohiba – posted 25 October 2004 17:46

love to mow,

I will defer my comments to a southerner such as yourself. Reading this forum, I am learning alot about warm season grasses and find it intresting to see the differences. I have opinions on almost everything but would rather keep them to myself as to not sound ignorant.

Hopefully someone from your area can help.

If you get no reply in a few days I will call a superintendent friend of mine in Texas and get a good answer for you.

Good Luck……………..

MikeY – posted 01 November 2004 11:33

Love to Mow:

You need to have a soil analysis done. That’s the only way you are going to know for sure what fert to be using on the lawn. Texas A&M will do it for you for about $20. Call them at 972-231-5362 and tell them you want some soil sample bags. They send them for free. I have a 3000sqft. lawn and I used 2 bags. After you send in the bags it takes about 2-3 weeks. They will tell you exaclty what to use (among many other interesting tidbits)

As for WHEN to fertilize…I’m no expert, but it really depends on how the lawn is growing. It’s Nov 1 and we have a cold front moving through. That will probably make the bermuda lawn slow WAY DOWN (if not make it dormant altogether). The last time I fertilized was mid-October and I wasn’t planning on anymore until spring. FYI , I used 16-20-0, at the recommendation of A&M.

turfie – posted 11 November 2004 09:26

Mike Y,

No potassium? Here in FL we always fertilize with high K in the fall to boost cold hardiness and help build reserves. Is it different in Texas? I’m not farmiliar with the soils there.

Stephanie

cohiba – posted 12 November 2004 09:04

Stephanie,

I agree with the high K in fall. Mike Y probably went off the recommendations of a soil test which is an excellent idea, by the way. My only problem is that a soil test tells how much K is in the soil, it doesn’t tell how much of that K is available for the plant to use. I like to use 0-0-50 in June and then again in December.

For what its worth………….

Take care……………..

turfie – posted 13 November 2004 17:59

Cohiba,

I am not aware of any reactions potassium undergoes in the soil to form insoluble complexes like calcium does (primarily with phosphates). Potassium either occurs on the cation exchange site or in soil solution, both plant available forms. We can’t keep potassium in our soils because it leaches so readily i.e. sandy soils, but clay soils would have much better retention I’m sure. I don’t think soil testing labs necessarily take into account what time of year it is when making recommendations. It is probably more of a standard and maybe even computer-assisted recommendation based strictly on nutrient levels in the soil. Be that as it may, an extra boost of potassium before winter may help the bermudagrass build up reserves and tolerate the stress of winter a little better. Research shows variable results with this and it probably depends largely on the species and/or cultivar turf you have.

Always enjoy your excerpts. Thanks for the reply.

Stephanie

monte mechler – posted 07 December 2004 20:51

Ok Everyone,

I need to know a simple schedule for feeding my lawn during the summer. It is now Dec 7 and my lawn (Tiff 419) has browned out as it should.

Do I feed it? Or let it stay domant until the spring. If so, what time, in the spring, should I scalp and feed the lawn.CheersLove to Mow

Buck – posted 08 December 2004 08:41

I have 419 in North Carolina and will do the following:

1) Hit it with a preemergent this week, I use Dimension 0-0-7, did this the first of September also.

2) Hit it with preemergent again March 1.

3) Current clip is 15/16ths. I’ll take that down while dormante the end of January to 7/16ths.

4) At first sign of greenup, usually early March, I’ll hit it with Milorganite 6-2-0, 35 # per 1,000 square feet.

5) A month later I begin monthly applications of Noculate 5-2-4, 50 pounds per 1,000.

6) Mow at 7/16ths until the fall.

7) If we have a lot of rain I hit it with Manni-Plex Total Turf between applications of fertilizer to snap it up fast.

Works for me.

br549 – posted 08 December 2004 18:34

That sure is a lot of milorganite to throw out at one time.

ted – posted 09 December 2004 09:36

he’s hitting it with a little over 2 pounds of actual nitrogen per 1000 sq. ft. in march. the grass won’t be fully “out” yet, and there’s still lots of cool weather around that time of year, so his burn/overfeeding potential is minimal. lots of things going on with his program, and he’s obviously knowledgeable, so we never argue with success! i would only recommend pro strength dimension, non granular, and soil testing ( which he’s probably doing). probably could get away in his market with some dormant (very dormant!) roundup applications on the winter weeds, since no pre-em is perfect, not even dimension.

Buck – posted 09 December 2004 12:44

Good summary Ted, especially about the 2#/1,000 of N in March. Milorganite is rather gentle and the temps here are highly variable in March. My plan is to have it available if needed. When its cool nothing really happens, but a few days in the 80s and I think the N gives it a good jump start for the season.

You’re right on the money about no preemerg is perfect. But I have had a devil of a time with roundup. The turf may look dormant, but I have had too many unpleasant kill zones when going after a few rouge weeds. Used roundup on Jan 31 one year and then spent six weeks in May and June getting coverage on that which I thoughht was dormant. So I no longer do that, too risky. I deal with any problems later in the spring. By the way, going with three apps of preemrg has helped a lot. If you wait until Februray or March and plan on only one app I find you have a lot of winter junk. The earlier apps of preemerg nails most of them and I then do not have to deal with roundup as very few get through. Also, my turf is on a sand base that drains off very rapidly and so I probably fertilize more often that others.

msumike1 – posted 10 January 2005 19:39

Thanks for all the questions and replies. I am going to scalp my overgrown, but dormant bermuda grass this weekend. Good discussion.

bwmaier – posted 12 January 2005 18:34

Ted:

How did you calculate the 2#N/1k sq feet a couple of posts above? I live about 35 miles west of Atlanta and have hybrid bermuda and clay like soil. Got a soil analysis last year and fertilize using 16-4-8 at 6#/1k. I do this about once a month. How do you calculate the amount of N per 1k?

I also applied lesco’s 5-10-20 preM/winterizer in early October (it did stain the grass, so prob will use a higher quality preM in fall ’05). Was planning on some dimension or lesco 0-0-7 by the end of January. When would be a good time for a third round of pre-M, assuming I apply the 0-0-7 by the end of January?

I’ve heard people say Lesco isn’t all that great, by my experiences with the fall/mid-winter application of the two listed above are very satisfied…no crabgrass.

Thanks for ya’ll’s ideas.

Buck – posted 13 January 2005 09:30

Not Ted, but to get the amount of nitrogen per 1,000 square feet take the number of pounds applied, in my case 35#, per 1,000 sq. ft. Multiply that by the percent N, in my case 6 – the first of the three numbers. 6 percent of 35 # is 2.1 pounds. So, I’m putting on just over 2 pounds of N per 1,000 sq. ft.

Buck

bwmaier – posted 13 January 2005 17:49

Thanks Buck. Didn’t realize the calculation was that easy. Good to know.

ted – posted 13 January 2005 20:09

yeah, just divide the first number on the bag into 100. that’s how many pounds of it to put down per 1000 sq.ft. to get 1 actual pound of nitrogen. ex: to achieve 1 actual pound of nitrogen per 1000 sq.ft. using 25-5-10, put down 4 pounds.

one pound of actual nitrogen per 1000 sq. ft. per month in the growing season is a very general guide line.

i see you’ve already been to lesco…

ted – posted 13 January 2005 20:16

Dimension is a good product, even at Lesco. it doesn’t stain. Lesco Pre-Em is a really old product. haven’t used it for probably 10 years. Lesco tends to be handy and semi-knowledgable, but they don’t have all the products most pros need. and the prices…..

Tifway 419 AZ – posted 21 January 2005 11:24

quote:Originally posted by cas6708:I have been reading up on reel mowers because I am thinking about getting one. But I have now read in a couple of different places that a push reel mower is not recommended for the Tiff 419 grass that I have.

Any suggestions, thoughts, or critism?

I bought a push reel mower last year. It works until you forget to cut it one week. Then the grass is too dense and it will not cut. Do not buy a PUSH REEL MOWER for Tifway 419

jbchristian – posted 31 March 2005 08:30

Hi bwmaier,

I just purchased a new home with new sod in August. Where did you go to get your soil analysis?Thanks.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by bwmaier:[B]Ted:

…I live about 35 miles west of Atlanta and have hybrid bermuda and clay like soil. Got a soil analysis last year and fertilize using 16-4-8 at 6#/1k. I do this about once a month. How do you calculate the amount of N per 1k?

Buck – posted 31 March 2005 09:15

Well, you’re putting 6# of fertilizer down per 1k/SqFt. You product is 16% N, the first of the three numbers. So, do the math 16% of 6# is .96# of N. So you are right there at 1# of N per 1,000 SqFt; and that is a good number for Benmuda.

bwmaier – posted 31 March 2005 10:48

jbchristian: I took several random samples from various spots in the yard and mixed them together. I sealed them up in a bag and took them to the Paulding County Extension agent’s office in Dallas. They sent the sample to UGA and mailed me the results. So, you can check with your local county extension agent. I’ve also heard that Lesco performs this service. I havve not used them, but may try them next year. Good luck.

Brian