Reboot ing this fall…re-establishing my fescue

MarkinAL – posted 25 June 2006 06:19

I planted fescue this spring and with watering and fertilizer I had a really lush, thick start (I live in Birmingham, AL). However, crabgrass and barnyardgrass have invaded much of my fescue. I was reluctant to try any herbicides since the grass was new, but now a fear that I have simply lost some sections of the lawn to the grassweeds. Could I have prevented this by applying a preimmergent fertiziler with crabgrass preventative after the new fescue had establish…say like April?

This fall, how would I best go about reestablishing my fescue? Before overseeding: should I simply roundup the spots enundated with crabrass or hit the entire lawn with a herbicide that kills these grassy weeds and try to preserve the existing fescue (Anyone have recommendations on which herbicide to use)?

Will crabgrass go dormant this winter. How do I get these nasty patches out of the yard so that the fescue can come in strong in Oct. and how do I prevent the weeds from coming back next spring/summer? My plan is to get the weeds out this fall (roundup or herbisides); aerate; fertize (no preimmergent obviously, over seed heavily…then apply reimmergent fertizer in the spring. Basically using fall and winter(mild here) to get the fescue strong and then go into preimmergent/prevention mode in the spring and summmer?

How long after a preimmergent is applied do you need to wait before attempting to seed in that soil?

[This message has been edited by MarkinAL (edited 25 June 2006).]

Grassguy – posted 25 June 2006 21:34

First let me turn you on to the best fescue on the planet,(in my opinion).http://www.fescue.com/info/turfseed/summerlawn.htmlDepending on the size of the area to be re-established I would sample the soil then Kill it all,(regrade,etc,mid september make recommended ammendments per soil test)with round up pro and spreader sticker.You can start killing at the end of august if you have a serious weed problem so you can make several application’s of herbicide before you re-seed to kill as many weeds as possible that pop up. Seed only at the recommended rate on the package. I think it’s 3 pounds per thousandon a total re-do.The pre-emergence can be applied for the pre spring weed season to beat back any enundation that may try to take place. After that proper cultural practices are a must for a great lawn. Mow the lawn for the first time when it is 40% higher than the desired height you want. Irrigation will depend on your soil type. If you have pure red clay it is very difficult to irrigate deeply with out a bunch of run off. Clay soil only has about 1%(irrigation reduces it further) oxygen available in the soil depending on organic matter content(which you can have tested as well)21% is a desired amount of oxygen to be present in the soil. Although optimal soil would contain enough poor space to have a 50-50 mix of oxygen and moisture retention. Deep roots(6-8 inchs) are what you want for fescue and clay soil is hard to achieve that with. the deeper you can get the water the deeper the roots will grow.Dont cut off more than 1/3rd of the turf at once which may require frequent mowing.As the turf germinates go from shallow frequent irrigation to deep infrequent irrigation to promote deep roots. If you have a soil purveyor in your area that has products such as flower mix and landscape mix that they bring out in a dump truck you can till that into the soil to increase the organic matter content to ultimatly achieve humus/carbon in the soil. I could go on forever but hopefully this will get you started. you will have to expect some weeds when re-establishing but this can be greatly reduced by getting the soil sampled through your local county extension to determine PH and available macro and micro nutrients and lime requirements. Having soil adjusted and suited for establishing fescue will allow the fescue to get an awesome start and foot hold so it will out compete the weeds. The better your prep the better the results. also that link that I provided, You may want to call them to be sure they dont have a better fescue blend recommendation for your area before purchasing. they are constantly developing new cultivars. In case my rambling is confusing:Test soil, follow instruction’s for doing so.Kill everything.when planting time arrives Make ammendments per soil test results.(till it into the soil to a 6 inch depth)Regrade if necessary, fill hole’s,low spots,remove rocks,stumps,etc and level the gound.Grade should be at least a 1% slope away from the home.use a lawn roller to lightly pack it down after you rake it out smooth then check for low spots again. Apply seed with a drop spreader at !recommended rates! roll again with the roller half full of water as before to increase seed/soil contact, cover with 1/4 inch of peat moss if feasable then irrigate as mentioned.(avoid pooling) there is another product on the market called “Turface” which is a soil agregate if the organic soil is not obtainable.best of luck

MarkinAL – posted 01 July 2006 07:28

Excellent, excellent information. Thanks!!

BTW: I actually have surprisingly good top soil for AL…not the typical red clay. My lot was cleared from previous forest…so that may have a lot to do with it.

I am definitely going to get the soil tested. I did get a simple PH testing kit and sure enough it showed that the soil was very acidic so I applied lime. I think regualar lime applications will be a must in this area.

I used the premium tall fesue from Lesco (something Eagle I think?) and it came up extremely well and has survived the heat. I will check out your reference and probably try it this fall.

My biggest mistake was waiting too long ( the grass was so beautiful ?! ) to put a herbiside on the grabgrass….Late June vs. early May when it first appeared. On some sections it looks like I have been able to make bid dent on the grabgrass by simply spraying with Orhto’s Weed Killer with Crabgrass killer. I am thinking about hitting it with a second spraying this month…and if that wipes out the grabgrass I will just overseed and spot repair. I am thinking that I will have little fescue left in a few heavily infested areas if the herbised completely kill the crabgrass by late summmer. Since I was successful in getting such a great seeding this spring, I am assuming I will have the same results this fall. I just need to learn how to get rid of the crab/barnyard/dallas grass and keep it out and I think I will have the beautful lawn I am looking for?!

quote:Originally posted by Grassguy:First let me turn you on to the best fescue on the planet,(in my opinion).http://www.fescue.com/info/turfseed/summerlawn.htmlDepending on the size of the area to be re-established I would sample the soil then Kill it all,(regrade,etc,mid september make recommended ammendments per soil test)with round up pro and spreader sticker.You can start killing at the end of august if you have a serious weed problem so you can make several application’s of herbicide before you re-seed to kill as many weeds as possible that pop up. Seed only at the recommended rate on the package. I think it’s 3 pounds per thousandon a total re-do.The pre-emergence can be applied for the pre spring weed season to beat back any enundation that may try to take place. After that proper cultural practices are a must for a great lawn. Mow the lawn for the first time when it is 40% higher than the desired height you want. Irrigation will depend on your soil type. If you have pure red clay it is very difficult to irrigate deeply with out a bunch of run off. Clay soil only has about 1%(irrigation reduces it further) oxygen available in the soil depending on organic matter content(which you can have tested as well)21% is a desired amount of oxygen to be present in the soil. Although optimal soil would contain enough poor space to have a 50-50 mix of oxygen and moisture retention. Deep roots(6-8 inchs) are what you want for fescue and clay soil is hard to achieve that with. the deeper you can get the water the deeper the roots will grow.Dont cut off more than 1/3rd of the turf at once which may require frequent mowing.As the turf germinates go from shallow frequent irrigation to deep infrequent irrigation to promote deep roots. If you have a soil purveyor in your area that has products such as flower mix and landscape mix that they bring out in a dump truck you can till that into the soil to increase the organic matter content to ultimatly achieve humus/carbon in the soil. I could go on forever but hopefully this will get you started. you will have to expect some weeds when re-establishing but this can be greatly reduced by getting the soil sampled through your local county extension to determine PH and available macro and micro nutrients and lime requirements. Having soil adjusted and suited for establishing fescue will allow the fescue to get an awesome start and foot hold so it will out compete the weeds. The better your prep the better the results. also that link that I provided, You may want to call them to be sure they dont have a better fescue blend recommendation for your area before purchasing. they are constantly developing new cultivars. In case my rambling is confusing:Test soil, follow instruction’s for doing so.Kill everything.when planting time arrives Make ammendments per soil test results.(till it into the soil to a 6 inch depth)Regrade if necessary, fill hole’s,low spots,remove rocks,stumps,etc and level the gound.Grade should be at least a 1% slope away from the home.use a lawn roller to lightly pack it down after you rake it out smooth then check for low spots again. Apply seed with a drop spreader at !recommended rates! roll again with the roller half full of water as before to increase seed/soil contact, cover with 1/4 inch of peat moss if feasable then irrigate as mentioned.(avoid pooling) there is another product on the market called “Turface” which is a soil agregate if the organic soil is not obtainable.best of luck