markngolf – posted 19 April 2003 06:42
Our St Augustine(Palmetto) lawn has been deteriorating progressively for the past three years. The lawn was new in Oct. 98 and looked fantastic for the first two years. We have had increasing areas of yellow and brown and last year lost quite a bit of lawn. We cut out the damaged areas and put in a pallet of new grass. By the end of the summer, all the new grass had severe damage and there was evidence of other areas with damage. A lawn expert discovered the presence of chinch bugs and treated the entire lawn early last fall. He said he felt the lawn would recover. Now, while it is still early in the spring(we live in coastal southeastern NC) the lawn looks worse that before. The areas that were lush and full last year, now have yellow and brown areas and the severly damaged areas seem to have no sign of life. The lawn expert said we might have to put in some plugs.
Now my questons:1) How long should we wait for the stolens to creep before deciding which areas may need some plugs?2) We had a very severe, cold winter and I accicently allowed the irrigation to run during some extremely cold days this past winter.(temps got down to teens and 20’s on a couple of days when the irrigation ran) I suspect we not only have damage from the chinch bugs we had last summer and early fall but new damage from winter kill. My second question is: What would my approach be to repair the damged areas, which are extensive? Should I just exhibit some patience and let the lawn repair itself or should I go ahead and do extensive resodding or plugging in the damaged areas.
We’ve put a gread deal of effort, time and money into caring for our lawn, with very poor results. While I trust the new lawn expert, who now has the fertilizer program for our lawn, I’d appreciate hearing from any of you who may have experienced similar problems and your solutions to them.Thanks,Mark
[This message has been edited by markngolf (edited 20 April 2003).]
wdrake – posted 29 April 2003 07:21
I hesitate answering as I have similar problem with no solution. If you are interested here is background information I sent with sample to the experts at the University of Florida a couple of years ago. They concluded I have “Take All Root Rot”; i.e., a fungus [Gaeumannomyces graminis var. graminis] that affects most if not allwarm-season turfgrasses. The fungus is naturally present on grass roots and shows up primarily during the summer and early fall months when there are prolonged periods of rain. The disease is also stress related so cutting too low, overwatering, too much shade, too much Nitrogen,etc probably encourages thelittle villains to do their dastardly deed. Best I can tell from the literature there isn’t much you can do to treat the disease. Some fungicides may help prevent it, but few offer much hope of curing it.
Anyway here is the rest of the story.
Bitter Blue St Augustine ?Sod healthy, looked good, good roots; 8 pallets. ?Checked with supplier in August. They had no reports of similar decline problems …. Laid in mid April. Surface tilled 5 or 6 inches, leveled, and rolled ?Sod rolled, watered and in about 2 weeks took root Once rooted; I watered only when needed.
Four weeks after laying, first sign of problem was what appeared to be dry spot, so I increased water. Problem was in deep shade so I assumed sunlight was a contributor. Maybe 40% of area died. Over next 2 to 3 weeks remaining shaded area thinned out to what it is now, maybe 50% coverage.
Sometime around four to six weeks after laying, similar ?dry spots? developed in full sun and eventually died. At first sign of problem I applied a Scotts fungicide and Diazinon. Saw no improvement in couple of weeks so I applied Daconil;. Two to three weeks; no improvement [improvement= no new infestation or areas of decline] I applied a systemic fungicide; Bayleton. and more Diazinon. Grass decline seemed to slow, but started again 3 or 4 weeks.
Hired lawn service which treated yard in July and August and twice in September. Two September treatments included spot spraying of a fungicide. They would not tell me what they were using, but advised that I not water in for 2 or 3 days so I assume it was some material designed to treat brown patch, or similar leaf (vice root) problem. During first visit in July lawn service guy identified problem as Chinch bugs and not enough water. After his first visit I increased length of watering cycle and can guarantee that at least most if not all of the area currently in decline received ¾ inch of water per week. With regard to Chinch bugs. lawn service guy showed me one or two bugs—although I could not identify them as Chinch bugs (i.e., they didn?t look like any of the life cycle stages described in the Florida Lawn Handbook). Bugs looked more like spider mites; almost round and jet-black, no white markings on wings and in fact I couldn’t see any wings. Whatever they are/were, the population was/is no more than 7 or 8 per square foot. In May and again in July I did your suggested test to flush them out with water. (Standing water in concentrated area for 5 or 6 minutes.) No Chinch bugs. Similar tests for mole crickets in May June and July yielded none. In fact I?ve only seen a half a dozen this year all in the April- May time period. In addition I have, almost daily performed ?on my knees, part the grass” examinations of three or four spots in the yard. Never seen more than one or two bugs on surface/ in thatch. Don?t see more than one Grub ever 3rd or 4th examination hole. Have not seen spittlebugs, arm worms, or anything to which I can attribute the damage.
In declining areas —Roots are gone or going —Grass stopped growing —Water stress symptoms —Grass doesn?t respond to foliage feeding or watering.
Have not checked shallow (`20 ft) well for salt water intrusion, but Azaleas are doing fine and I understand they are super sodium sensitive.
Other clues:
1. Property is water front (bayou) 10 – 12 feet above seal level. St Augustine at water’s edge that gets flooded once or twice a year is in much better shape than areas with “new” sod. In addition waterfront turf does not get fertilized, or irrigated.
2. In areas of decline there has been no massive invasion of weeds. There has been no recovery – once the decline begins I’ve been unable to reverse the process
3. I cut up a dozen or so sod strips and used for sprigging around the yard, essentially all of them died. Another dozen pieces of sod were used to patch bad areas in another yard (6+ miles from my house) all lived and have grown profusely.
4. Sharp mower blade. Cutting height at 3+inches. Removed no more than 1/4th of the blade each cutting. Catch clippings.
5. Bitter Blue represent ~30% of yard. Other St Augustine turf (some adjacent to the Bitter Blue) is OK- if not outstanding
6. No blanket application of herbicides this year to declining areas
7. Obviously I didn’t re-sod areas were the grass was doing well. These have been trouble spots for past 4 or 5 years. I have attributed past poor performance of St Augustine in these areas to bad cultural practices of over watering and cutting too short.
Bill Drake 806 Weeden Is Dr Niceville, FL 32578 wdrake@sprintmail.com
George777 – posted 29 April 2003 19:39
take all patch ( Gaeumannomyces graminis) is a new problem here in Alabama. In my area it has been in St. Aug and Zoysia. I would call your local county extension agent and let him come to your home and take a sample. he should be able to get you an answer what to do. I was informed that if you got take all patch that it is a nightmare to control. I can’t remember the 2 fungicides he told me you can use. If you do have take all patch I do know that ammonium choride or ammonium sulfate can reduce the disease pressure.
markngolf – posted 30 April 2003 01:43
Thanks George. A turf farm owner suggested I make that contact. (contact my county extension). I have not yet done so, but you reminded me so I’ll take the suggestion and contact them. I appreciate the time you took to reply to my message. “Lawn Misery loves company”Mark(markngolf@atmc.net)
markngolf – posted 30 April 2003 01:48
Hi Bill,I certainly appreciate the time and effort you put into replying to my “St. Augustine problem”. Your experience sounds like “deja vu ” to me. I’m not sure what steps I’ll employ to remedy the damage. I’m thinking of replacing the St. Augustine with another type grass; perhaps centipede or zoisa. It would be very expensive. Another possibility is to take out quite a bit of grass and just allow it to be natural and cover it with pine straw, but this would be a last resort because I really do love the look of a beautiful lawn around the property and encircling the flower and plant beds. I’m very frustrated and the money issue is a difficult one for we are retired and on a fixed income without a great deal of “fat” in the budget.I’ve attached some digital pictures. I’d be interested in your feedback, providing you have the time and interest. Again, I want to thank you for your informative reply. It put improves my perspective on the issue.Markmarkngolf@atmc.net627 Lake Shore DriveSunset Beach, NC 28468
boilermaker03 – posted 12 March 2008 08:39
I would suggest looking at your Manganese levels. Take All is often associated with low levels of available Manganese. One problem many of you may have is soils with high levels of Potassium, which can even further increase the need for Manganese.
In terms of fungicide applications, preventative apps are essential! You must apply the fungicide prior to dormancy in the fall or early spring. Once you see the damage, you are already too late. The pathogen has already done its work of destroying roots and crowns.
Fertilizer like ammonium sulfate will help reduce pressure. Aerifying prior to fertilizing and applying fungicides, and then watering them in will also help prevent the disease.
In terms of irrigation…check the pH of your water. If you are watering with something over 6.5, you are just helping to increase the environment for the pathogen. It likes an environment with a pH of >6.5